(The board for some reason turns "Caltech '04" into "Caltech \'04" so I have altered my name slightly. Maybe I'll just go back to "Joe" eventually. That's what I used in high school.)

This is pretty welcome after the awful, awful formatting of PR currently. I didn't care too much about how severely they censored the posts, I just hate that new format!

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3674&forum_id=1#47463)

edit: There's dude here by the postname of Wallace Wynne that is on his way to your fine institution next year. Can I point him your way?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3674&forum_id=1#47485)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3674&forum_id=1#55364)

;-)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3674&forum_id=1#47892)

I'm the dumbest one in this thread!

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3674&forum_id=1#48278)

OK, I am a current HS Junior trying to think of schools to apply to. I have never really considered CalTech, but recently they have been sending me a lot of stuff... and I am beginning to think they have some unique things to offer. Assume that I am pretty smart and a possible Presidential Scholar, NMF, etc.

1) I don't think I have what it takes to be a top-flight scientist. I have have done really well in HS math and science, and have the test scores, but I really enjoy the social sciences more, especially economics. I will def be applying to Chicago, Yale, etc.

2) How is Cal's econ department? More importantly, does anyone major in it, and if they do, do they get into good grad schools? Are there undergrad Econ research opportunities?

3) How would making it clear in my app that although I can handle the core math+science, my true love is NOT science, affect my admissions chances? Is CalTech looking for "diversity," or do they only care about math/science brains? I don't know if I would get in on merit-especially since I am a white male.

Thanks!

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3674&forum_id=1#53661)

2) People definitely major in economics here and do get into good grad schools. It's a small department but very high-quality. Caltech's last Nobel Prize, in 2002, was won by an undergraduate alum in Economics. There are plenty of research opportunities in Economics, particularly since there are probably more Econ professors than there are Econ undergrads! Summer research through the Caltech SURF program (you get paid $5500 for a 10-week research project) is one of the more attractive options. You have to apply, but the acceptance rate for proposals is around 70%.

3) I'm not so sure on that. Caltech is not looking for diversity in terms of using affirmative action in admissions (although they certainly do in awarding scholarships, free trips out to see the campus, etc.) And they aren't looking for a lot of diversity in people's primary interests--should be math and science--but Econ here is considered part of that. It's an extremely rigorous, math-oriented program. I don't think a potential Econ major would be looked down upon any more than a Math major who doesn't care much about science, or a Bio major who isn't into physics and math would be.

That said, your first two years at Caltech will mostly be taking the "core"--math, physics, chemistry and biology classes required of everyone. If you don't have at least some affinity for math and physics, you won't have a fun time. After the first two years, you'll be focused on your major and taking mostly Econ and any applicable math classes. (I think the Econ major is fairly flexible and you also would have room for other classes that interest you.)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3674&forum_id=1#55647)

I think I've pretty much settled on going to Michigan to do my M.S. (Aerospace Engineering--really it's just the first year of the Ph.D. program), and then either returning to Caltech or heading to Princeton to finish out the Ph.D. I've got some informal reassurance that this is a reasonable plan of action from the faculty.

It's a decision made for a variety of reasons, not all academic. I do believe Caltech is the best place on earth to study experimental fluid mechanics. On the other hand, I also have some desire to get a different experience, and there are personal factors leading me to want to return to my home state for a year. I think this course of action strikes a good balance.

I was personally admitted, with fellowship or RA funding (TA funding is more onerous and a sign that they don't want you as much as the fellowship and RA folks), to aerospace/aeronautics Ph.D. programs at Caltech, MIT, Princeton, Stanford, Michigan, and Purdue. Most other people heading to grad school from Caltech did very well in grad placement, as far as I know. It is certainly more common to go elsewhere than to stay, but I do know of people who do stay and are quite successful at that. The option was open to me, as mentioned above, but I am sort of splitting the difference. Almost all schools in most academic fields will encourage you to go elsewhere for grad school (the most notable exception is probably MIT, which is notorious for inbreeding). Caltech is no exception in that regard, but if you make a strong case for admission and Caltech has a graduate program well-suited for what you want to study, you can certainly be admitted as a Caltech undergrad.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3674&forum_id=1#61681)

It's interesting that you feel MIT is notorious for inbreeding as I was told by several MIT graduates (mostly from the MIT grad school) that MIT has rules against even considering MIT undergrads for their doctoral programs in some areas. Are you talking about inbreeding for master's level work or doctoral work?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3674&forum_id=1#62422)

I’m talking about inbreeding at all levels—undergrads staying on as grad students, and grad students staying on as professors. Believe it or not, I’ve actually compiled statistics on this, based upon the faculty bios of the Aero/Astro department listed at: http://web.mit.edu/aeroastro/www/people/index.html. (This was as part of a larger study of where aerospace professors at the top aerospace schools did their Ph.D.s. My conclusions, by the way—and I can send you the spreadsheet of data, if you like—were that MIT was by far the best school to have a Ph.D. from if you wanted to teach at MIT, but if you wanted to teach at any of the other top schools surveyed, it was better to have a Ph.D. from Caltech.)

Of the 34 MIT Aero/Astro professors who have bios online (only 2 don’t), 13 have no MIT affiliation, 9 did only their graduate work at MIT, and 12 did all three of their degrees at MIT. (No one did only the BS or only the BS/MS at MIT). This is a very high rate, compared with other departments, of inbreeding both in the sense of hiring one’s own grad students as professors and also of one’s own undergrads staying on as grads.

Above I’ve sampled only one department, which I’m sure you would quickly challenge. However, words from the MIT admissions office itself will easily extend my observation of this trend across the entire school:

“Each year, roughly equal numbers of seniors go on to graduate school (~43%) or join the workforce (~48%). Of those who go on to graduate school, a majority (~56%) stay at MIT for a M.Eng, M.S, Ph.D, or Sc.D. If you want to get your graduate degree from MIT, in most cases your best strategy is to attend MIT as an undergraduate!”

http://web.mit.edu/admissions/www/2006/lifeaftermit.html#gradschool

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3674&forum_id=1#64109)

Obviously there are pluses and minuses for the students involved, but the fact that it's common in the first place is clear. Or, as Boondocks might put it, "manifest." ;-)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3674&forum_id=1#80284)

I've gone to Caltech for 4 years, and (up until a week ago) I visited the PR website fairly often, and I have no idea how or when that data is collected. I certainly never had the chance to rank Caltech in any categories.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3674&forum_id=1#83201)