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Had Interesting Convo with Latham Partner Recently
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Date: September 8th, 2009 10:40 PM Author: free-loading doctorate
My firm has been working with LW on a recent case. When I spoke to him last month, the Latham partner I'm working with was praising the firm's management committee, saying the firm was now in a much better position than many of its competitors (he mentioned Clifford Chance as a firm with big problems), and talked about how the firm was minimizing its "leverage". I asked if "leverage" meant "hard working associates", and he said yes.
I don't quite get this. Aren't associates who bill even a modest number of hours annually profitable for the firm? |
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Date: September 8th, 2009 10:45 PM Author: sable base internal respiration That sounds like it can't possibly be right. Low leverage means low PPP. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12698992) |
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Date: September 8th, 2009 10:48 PM Author: Electric Generalized Bond you just make up for it by making the remaining associates work harder. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12699045) |
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Date: September 8th, 2009 10:52 PM Author: free-loading doctorate
That's what I mean. Not to sound populist but the current downturn has led to a lot of irrational thinking. Suddenly the associates that made partners rich are the problem.
Another partner I met blamed law firm woes on escalating associate salaries. Haven't PPP risen at an equal or higher rate over the same period?
Both of these guys were very senior, so it's reasonable to presume their thinking is common among the management teams at firms.
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Date: September 8th, 2009 11:04 PM Author: Electric Generalized Bond Maximum leverage leads to max profit when your at or near full capacity, i.e. associates billing 2200-2400 as a whole. if avg billables drop around 30% to 1500 it still makes sense to cut 30% of your labor force to maximize profits. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12699277) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 12:30 AM Author: Sadistic Pozpig yes (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12700119) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 12:31 AM Author: Sadistic Pozpig "Another partner I met blamed law firm woes on escalating associate salaries."
common and dumb, as you suggest |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 12:38 AM Author: Hyperactive Mad Cow Disease Rigor did you bring up the reputational hit? seems that would be a problem (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12700172) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 12:52 AM Author: ungodly headpube library Clients won't give a shit that they laid off 1st year associates since the same clients probably made even deeper cuts. Recruiting may suffer, but it will be greatly tempered by ITE. Biggest threat to LW is continued overcapacity which will hit the firm's bottom line and cause profitable partners to leave. if the cuts did what they were intended to do then LW may come out ok. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12700257) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 12:57 AM Author: magical honey-headed therapy even ITE they're going to get worse people. when ITE is over they'll feel this effect even more. even if everyone has forgotten this, which i doubt, they fell a lot in the vault rankings, and will probably fall more next year. for that reason alone they'll attract worse talent.
not only that, but people are already leaving and will leave when ITE is over. other firms in the top ten didn't do this because it's bad for the firm in the long run, especially post ATL. do you really think latham is better run than every firm in the v10 and v20? if they were such great managers they would've seen the recession coming and wouldn't have hired huge 08 and 09 classes. if they'd had the foresight to get the size of these classes right, none of this would have happened. |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 1:59 AM Author: Rebellious Fantasy-prone Roommate Forum That's assuming everything stays the same after ITE and firms stay with lockstep and the 8 year partner track for all associates. No other industry runs like that, and Latham seems to be run more like an ibank (hire big in boom times, fire big in lean times, repeat). (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12700742) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 5:05 AM Author: concupiscible lime theater stage dingle berry except they don't pay like an i-bank (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12701307) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 12:33 AM Author: Hyperactive Mad Cow Disease Rigor what a douche (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12700147) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 1:51 AM Author: free-loading doctorate Actually this guy is generally super nice and a good attorney, former AUSA. I don't think he had any idea what a dick he sounded like. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12700689) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 1:56 AM Author: Rusted french chef temple What did he do as an AUSA to end up lateraling to LW as a partner or a senior associate? white collar? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12700718) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 2:46 AM Author: magical honey-headed therapy (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12700997) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 3:01 AM Author: concupiscible lime theater stage dingle berry does he realize Latham is becoming the Shearman^10 of this recession? that dump is so poorly managed he probably has no idea what's going on. the firms that bite the bullet during this recession are going to get through it better than latham. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12701044) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 3:03 AM Author: ungodly headpube library unless it gets worse before it gets better. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12701058) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 3:06 AM Author: concupiscible lime theater stage dingle berry they'll manage it better than latham. this happened in part because latham expanded recklessly without having built up broad practices. case in point, bankruptcy and lit at latham ny are small, weak practice groups with TTT partners. unlike at the bigboys, latham just does not get enough work in these groups to carry the firm.
also, latham's corp group is second and third choice for a lot of ny clients. firms hire dpw, skadden, debevoise, over latham. when there isn't enough work, latham gets completely pwned. that's why good firms seriously pwned latham in this recession.
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Date: September 9th, 2009 4:24 AM Author: free-loading doctorate We didn't spend too much time on the subject (this was just over a lunch break). I'm not going to get into too many details about the guy's background for fear of outing myself.
He talked a lot about how the mgmt committee is composed of partners who ara also working with clients and doing everyday stuff so they stay attuned to what's going on.
I think a lot of you law students overestimate this "reputational hit". I don't think many firms ITE are concerned with what law students think, there are plenty more where the current crop came from. However, if highly productive partners threaten to bolt, that's much more serious. BigLaw Partner DukeSucks explained this subject fairly well elsewhere.
In any event, even if this partner had doubts about Latham's direction, it isn't like he was going to criticize mgmt in front of me. What would that do for him? |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 5:04 AM Author: concupiscible lime theater stage dingle berry partners are already bolting.
he's being very shortsighted, unless you want to make an argument for how Shearman wasn't damaged.
if this is wrong then why aren't the rest of the v20 firms following latham? |
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Date: September 10th, 2009 2:22 AM Author: Bonkers idiot Former AUSA? How long has he been a partner? Any reason to beleive he knows much more than you about when a law firm is well run? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12709688) |
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Date: September 10th, 2009 5:23 AM Author: free-loading doctorate He's pretty old, I think a long time.
I'm sure he doesn't know more than XOXO conventional wisdom. |
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Date: September 10th, 2009 5:42 AM Author: Wine abnormal trump supporter Most partners at any firm do not know much about how their firm is being run and do not care. They are there to practice the law and get paid. The benefit of being at a firm is that you can rely on other people to do everything from managing the firm to hiring/firing associates to taking out the trash.
There's a good chance the Latham partner you spoke to doesn't know anything more than whatever party line was presented by the management committee at the last partners meeting |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 8:01 AM Author: Crawly beady-eyed stead personal credit line The amount you bill and the amount the firm actually collects are very different. ITE, i'd imagine that it's very low. So you can staff as many associates on a bond offering as you'd want, but all that could end up happening is that a pissed off client isn't willing to pay for their hours and you're stuck w/ paying out salaries to those associates. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12701381) |
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Date: September 10th, 2009 1:03 AM Author: concupiscible lime theater stage dingle berry *falls backwards out of chair*
what an idiot |
Date: September 8th, 2009 11:08 PM Author: Lascivious Mint Son Of Senegal http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F5aOnOLwig (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12699321) |
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Date: September 8th, 2009 11:16 PM Author: pale cerebral office this (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12699424) |
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Date: September 8th, 2009 11:28 PM Author: Wine abnormal trump supporter Congrats to LW for taking the bold measures needed to surpass their peer firm, Clifford Chance. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12699549) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 12:34 AM Author: Hyperactive Mad Cow Disease Rigor don't forget proskauer, their other peer (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12700154) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 12:40 AM Author: Lascivious Mint Son Of Senegal http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clifford_Chance
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Date: September 9th, 2009 12:46 AM Author: Stimulating confused hell stain my ears are burning (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12700222) |
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Date: September 9th, 2009 3:23 AM Author: concupiscible lime theater stage dingle berry (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1081628&forum_id=2#12701132) |