Date: April 10th, 2012 8:09 PM Author: Diverse elastic band
well I'm just a lawyer, but when he talks about the law it's really frightful. you can point out that he hasn't had the benefit of law school, but law is for fucktards; I knew everything I know now coming in more or less. if you need law school to get a legal issue that you've spent some time thinking about, and there are a few he thinks about quite a bit, you're an idiot
Date: April 10th, 2012 8:15 PM Author: french big water buffalo
hey, i'd say the same about me --except that on a board filled with lots of very intelligent people, i'm 100% certain somebody's got me beat. anyhow, i'm not an unemployed t14'er or making 50k in shitlaw with a HYP degree, either
Date: April 10th, 2012 8:32 PM Author: Diverse elastic band
I mean, it's not even that she's substantively wrong about anything, it's just the horrible way in which she argues for the stuff she thinks. everything's an insane non sequitur or an ad hominem of some sort, or an appeal to what "normal men" really think
Date: April 10th, 2012 8:45 PM Author: crusty business firm bbw
The guy above is 100% correct about how you write and try to formulate arguments. It doesn't mean you're dumb per se, but you're not a clear thinker or very insightful, at least with regard to any topics you discuss on XO.
Date: April 10th, 2012 8:49 PM Author: Sienna startled space
yes i tend to appeal to social norms rather than arguing in formal debate style the way most xoxo posters do. i treat the board as i would a conversation and most people irl don't nitpick the way people on xoxo do, and just accept/understand things in a way most xoxo posters dont
also i dont care about being considered smart here. i disagree with most people here on almost everything so i know its an uphill battle. and i dont spend a lot of time trying to make brilliant arguments or whatever. why do that when you can, like the above poster noted, use an ad hominem? lol
a lot of people on the board clearly care a lot about being considered smart by others, i dont so i guess this is why you find what i say lacking but that doesn't mean im not insightful irl
Date: April 10th, 2012 8:55 PM Author: crusty business firm bbw
disagree on appealing to social norms vs. XO 'formal debate style' or whatever. XO doesn't adhere to any formal debate style, unless you're using that as a stand-in for 'coherent argument of the points.' like the guy said, you go full-speed into crazy personal attacks, assumptions and rarely include any substance. maybe that's a feature of all the time you spend arguing on here - you're not interested in making a point, just going back-and-forth.
i also disagree that you appeal to social norms that XO can't understand. you seem glued to the notion that this board is full of extremely bizarre people, but the label seems to be conveniently applied to people who happen to disagree with you (e.g. me in about 2 minutes after you read this).
you're also creating a false dichotomy here. nobody insists that you make "brilliant arguments" on XO. i think the point from the guy above is that for a person who is smart on paper, most of your 'arguments' on XO are borderline retarded, or, as he said, aren't really arguments at all - they're just name-calling and weird assumptions.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:05 PM Author: Sienna startled space
xoxo posters are mostly lawyers and as such are really concerned with detail and proving things concretely.
you're going to dislike this argument, but most conversations irl aren't so concerned with minutiae and proof. and saying things like "most people think X, Y or Z" isn't seen as stupid the way it is on xoxo. xoxo posters don't really like any argument that can't be proved with a link or something, some things are just so and most people just accept that they are. i think this is why i am frustrated on here a lot.
like i said i think of xoxo more as a conversation than a debate and irl conversations you're not constantly being challenged over small points or bitched at for things that aren't really proper debate style but are understood by most people (such as ad hominems). i dont put a lot of effort or thought into things i post here so if its easier to respond with an ad hominem or something thats what ill do. everyone irl understands me well enough. if i'm writing a paper or discussing something academic that deserves serious attention i write differently.
to me, xoxo is like a conversation in passing with a friend. no ones going to say "omg thats a non sequitur what's wrong with you?" or "your appeal to social norms is unfounded! how do you know that most guys wouldn't reject a girl for being 1 year above his cutoff?!?!?" a lot of other posters seem to think of it as a debating contest or academic forum.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:10 PM Author: Diverse elastic band
well if you say "most white guys like kim kardahian," it is seen as stupid off xoxo. it's all about how realistic or ridiculous your claims are about what most ppl think.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:25 PM Author: Sienna startled space
...when did i say that the guys i know are representative of "most guys?"
i certainly never argue that most white guys like kim k. i HAVE argued against people who say that no white guys like her. this obviously isn't true. i don't know what "most white guys" think about her and i wouldn't claim to.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:27 PM Author: Diverse elastic band
oh good, glad we agree on that now. I thought you had some reason for talking about what the guys you knew thought about her, but if you were just telling a story that wasn't supposed to illustrate anything (other than that there are some white guys who like her, which yeah, duh, look at the dude she married), that's cool
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:34 PM Author: Sienna startled space
in those kim kardashian threads, whenever i say that she's hot a bunch of guys always try to argue that she's hideous and that no men find her hot. this obviously isn't true, otherwise she wouldn't be famous (she has no talent) and she wouldn't appear in men's magazines such as maxim and playboy constantly, nor would she appear on those year-end hottest/sexiest women lists. i just feel like im in the twilight zone when people try to argue that no one finds her hot because the woman has made her entire career off of being hot. the only thing she's known for is her ass!
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:37 PM Author: Diverse elastic band
oh so you ARE arguing she's hot. well no, she's not. that ass is way too fat and she has an ugly face. I don't deny that some white guys feel differently, but I don't think most do
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:53 PM Author: Sienna startled space
yes there is a critical mass of white guys who like her. i didnt say "most" do.
do you think she would be in white men's magazines and be world famous for being hot if there weren't a lot of white men who find her hot? she's not someone who is solely popular in black/hispanic circles, like amber rose or buffy the buddy.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:12 PM Author: crusty business firm bbw
well, i suppose, but as one of the dreaded overly analytical lawyers, i can say that nothing that happens around here really approximates legal argument, nor are most lawyers especially good at arguing anything outside of narrow points of law. i agree that people do set ridiculous and arbitrary burdens of proof on many debate topics around here, but without getting too person, i'd say that's kind of a glass house issue in your case.
so far as treating it like a conversation, fine, but then are you telling me that IRL if someone disagrees with you, the appropriate response is to say they're aspie or whatever?
look, i really, really don't want to fight with you - i've seen how that goes - i'm just saying, 100% objectively, you do not come off as being thoughtful, insightful, or even coherent a lot of the time on XO. maybe i see your worst threads, i don't know. either way, most of the time i do see you, your posting is just insults, weird asides, and personal assumptions about whoever you're arguing with -- very, very little substance in between all that. honestly, i hope you don't converse that way in real life.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:29 PM Author: Sienna startled space
like i said, my conversations progress differently irl. i never find myself arguing over such petty things that most people just accept so no my conversations do not end up being this tortured and tedious irl nor do i need to call people aspie lol. rarely do i say things that are just completely interpreted by people who need to manipulate what im saying to fit some narrow idea of how things "must" be.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:36 PM Author: crusty business firm bbw
i just don't see how this informs on communicating the way you do on here. most threads aren't a real-time conversation with a friend. i'm referring to circumstances where you're ostensibly arguing a point with someone, and all i see is the name-calling, ranting, and so on.
i don't think it's weird that people would ask for cogency in a format like this. it's fine to say, "this is how i do it, deal with it." but then it's not very cool to say XO is generally weird because nobody else thinks that's representative of clear thought and expression.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:46 PM Author: crusty business firm bbw
lack or articulation seems to be your issue. i read you loud and clear - i get the impression that you're frustrated that i'm not giving you the response you'd prefer. it seems like that's part of the problem. you believe your comments should be persuasive no matter the quality. that's not going to come across as rational to many people, even if you feel it flies conversationally.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:57 PM Author: crusty business firm bbw
i read your last serious post to be that you're complaining that your style of expressing yourself on XO is based on how people react to you and converse with you in person. you don't see why XO doesn't conform to that mode of interaction. people in face-to-face conversation "just understand," and you're frustrated that this somehow doesn't translate to an internet forum.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:17 PM Author: fragrant gunner headpube
gentlemen: please observe this fine example of the blue smoke rule, locally known as the BSR.
"nothing i say is serious because i don't try so i can't be held to any standard, lol. except when i want my point to be respected/acknowledged, in which case i am serious and you are a virgin basement faggot if you dismiss me because of my history of utterly stupid comments. but only i get to decide when you take me seriously, lol."
this is probably her greatest innovation. effectively, anything dumb she says is not reflective of her intelligence because she isn't attempting to make fancy "lawyer arguments." but if she wants to make an actual argument, then you're not allowed to hold all the dumbassery against her. really clever stuff.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:20 PM Author: Sienna startled space
sigh. this is what i mean
people say i use "aspie" too much but when people like you can't understand nuance (i don't treat xoxo like a debate=/=nothing i say is serious) that's how you come off to me. i just never have to get into arguments about stuff like this irl because people just...get it.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:24 PM Author: fragrant gunner headpube
seriously mane, you sound fucking retarded when you start insisting that posters are aspies because they don't "get" the subtle nuances of your completely ridiculous assertions. disagreeing =/= not "getting" whatever you're espousing.
you don't "get" that, so u = aspie. see how that works jigaboo?
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:32 PM Author: fragrant gunner headpube
funny thing is, that's not even what you said or how you conduct yourself, so bullshit on two points. but since i'm a weird guy who sort of thinks comments should be somewhat in line with reality (i know what an anal retentive lawyer stickler!), i'm prone to no being able to follow the tortured pseudo-reasoning you're going to go through to justify this dumbassery.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:37 PM Author: Sienna startled space
you represented my argument as this: "nothing i say is serious"
i never said this anywhere in my post. you're so close-minded that you somehow interpret "not debating" to mean "not being serious" as though you can only be serious if you're arguing in a strict debate style
like, how do you misinterpret things like this? i just dont get it.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:52 PM Author: fragrant gunner headpube
like, you have, like, argued this before. i have seen this exact excuse from you. someone calls out how completely awful and easily pwnable you are when you attempt to push an argument, and you say "no fuck you because i just post fast and conversationally and don't pay attention to what i'm saying or worry about all this dry legal reasoning." you're doing a variation the same tired shit here. someone(s) points out that you look like a tard and just argue with insults, and say "yeah man but to me it's just like a conversation i would have IRL and everyone IRL totally gets me, so you guys are all weird."
as before, your argument is that we shouldn't even attempt to apply normal standards of clarity or coherence to what you say and thus shouldn't take it as a serious representation of what you're thinking. unless you want it to be taken that way because you're like, super cereal. you arbitrarily decide when.
ugh, congratulations horseface, this thread is now about u. you might seem like a fucking dolt on XO, but you are a true born talented master woman at jacking threads.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:56 PM Author: Sienna startled space
youre still not getting what im saying
anyway youre clearly one of a number of clearly extremely happy and well-adjusted people who just want to attack the looks and intellect of an internet stranger so why don't you just skip to that and skip the tedious misinterpretations of what i am saying? it will save both of us time.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:15 PM Author: Sienna startled space
i guess most of my friends arent lawyers (thank god) but when we're talking we dont use an argument format. we just...converse. i dont know how to say it, but most people don't penalize you for saying things that aren't directly and completely responsive to the last thing the person responded to you said, or appealing to socially accepted ideas that can't really be proven, or discussing the person's attributes rather than what they're saying. of course, you shouldn't do this in a debate or academic writing but like i said i dont consider an xoxo discussion on # of sexual partners or something a debate and i wouldn't put any more effort into it than i would if i were discussing the same thing at a bar with people. i just say what comes to mind.
im not a lawyer, im not as detail-oriented and clearly im in the minority. i dont think this makes me worse than anyone else here, but xoxo doesn't really value the intelligence of non-intj types anyway. the board seems to value people who have very exact, detailed and literal ways of thinking and writing. like i said this makes sense for a board full of lawyers.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:23 PM Author: Sienna startled space
someone above said that the things i say aren't really wrong, they just aren't argued correctly
i dont really care about arguing things correctly
look, think what you want about my intelligence. i am considered intelligent enough irl and i am smart enough to do the things i want to do. if xoxo posters want to believe that i'm stupid, or not smart, or whatever, i can live with that. i was just attempting to explain where im coming from.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:28 PM Author: Diverse elastic band
I mean, a lot of the things you say make no more sense than "the sky is blue because so is your shirt." that's not an issue of arguing correctly, it's just nonsense. even though yeah, the sky is blue
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:31 PM Author: Sienna startled space
i dont say things like this. if you could point out an example that would be instructive. most of the time the people who call me stupid are just complaining about me calling someone aspie.
Date: April 10th, 2012 10:01 PM Author: Sienna startled space
i take aspie to mean someone who doesn't understand social norms
since "aging" has to do with other people's reactions to aesthetic changes, if you don't understand how other people think you won't understand other people's reactions to aging.
Date: April 10th, 2012 10:06 PM Author: Diverse elastic band
I think aspieness has nothing to do with not getting ppl's reactions to aging, but even if it did, do you not see how it's infuriating and pointless to argue with someone whose only response to anything you say is that you must have a mental problem that prevents you from seeing that their position is right?
Date: April 10th, 2012 10:08 PM Author: Sienna startled space
ALL of the threads on subjective things like male aging revolve around people arguing that their position is correct and the other side's position is incorrect (because they're aspies or shrews or whatever).
what other arguments can be made? it's subjective so all you can do is point to irl examples and try to argue the superiority of your position vis a vis others'.
Date: April 10th, 2012 8:44 PM Author: Sienna startled space
thank you for intentionally drawing out the usual suspects to say that im stupid, was an AA admit to yale, lied about going to stuyvesant, lied about my lsat score, won't get into med school etc etc
seems weird for people to attack you for a lack of intelligence, or to attribute your life choices to a lack of intelligence. that's clearly not your issue.
you're stupid in the way you present yourself on XO.
you're clearly not IRL stupid, though. you're smart enough to have virtually endless, really good opportunities presented to you. of course you get an AA bump, but who gives a shit; you're still adequately smart to do most things.
but intelligence promises little in life, and potential is determined by other things in combination with intelligence. it just seems like the wrong tack to attack you for not fulfilling your potential.
and, by the way, i don't "always" call you stupid. i never talk about you to anyone but you, and as you well know, we barely spoke outside of a one month (or so) span when i just couldn't take you anymore.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:47 PM Author: Sienna startled space
this exchange is a good example of why people think im stupid on here i think
i said you "always" say im stupid, not really meaning that you always do it, but that you did it a lot at some point, over that week-2 week period. rather, you said it enough for me to believe that it's a genuine opinion of yours.
i am really lazy wrt how i present things on here so i do stuff like that all the time. ill say "always" to mean "did it a lot in the past" because im sloppy in casual conversation and like to use shorthand to save myself time, even if it's not precise. most people on the board don't do this and i'm always being picked at for stuff like this.
irl the person i was speaking to would just get that i meant that they called me stupid a number of times and didn't literally mean they were constantly doing it. i feel like people use imprecise language a lot and i am particularly guilty of this. i think you guys don't since you are lawyers and you're trained to be detailed and thorough and exact. i once dated a lawyer and he drove me crazy because he would pick apart bits and pieces of things i was saying without responding to the thrust.
anyway this long post wasn't meant to attack you, i just wanted to point out what i think is a difference in communications style between myself and most of the board.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:58 PM Author: Sienna startled space
yes i use hyperbole a lot and just use the closest shorthand to whatever i want to say. in casual conversations people do this all the time (especially using always to mean often) and i dont ajust my voice for xoxo
Date: April 10th, 2012 10:02 PM Author: Sienna startled space
itis just part of me not being as exact and formal as everyone else
and most people on the board dont do it, otherwise i wouldnt constantly be called out for it. if it were convention people wouldn't feel the need to correct me.
Date: April 10th, 2012 10:11 PM Author: Sienna startled space
why oh why oh why did i respond to this thread?
see the thing is i hate discussions like this. i hate arguing about what i see as petty crap. it's so...boring to me. i would have been so much happier if i had simply called all of you aspies, told you to fuck yourselves and been on my way.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:44 PM Author: carmine wonderful step-uncle's house
Nobody who is being genuine would think you're dumb in real life, especially compared to the average schmo on the street.
But on XO, you write shitty, think shitty, and overall ARE shitty. You seem irrational, mad, disingenuous, and mostly batshit nuts when you're posting on study meds or drunk. You never post anything creative, funny, or interesting. 90% of your posts are endless bitch fests with pumos where you literally seem like you've out of your mind.
Again, you are most certainly smart. But, if someone were to just observe your posts on XO from any given week and know nothing else about you, they would think you are a deluded ape who didn't graduate from high school.
Date: April 10th, 2012 10:04 PM Author: Sienna startled space
if "someone" were another xoxo poster or lawyer, yeah. if "someone" were just a regular person, no, because they would understand why i speak the way i do.
Date: April 10th, 2012 10:54 PM Author: swashbuckling lay
Now you're actually trying to insist that XO posters and lawyer are all somehow bizarre communicators on a different wavelength than the rest of humanity? Jesus Christ. The post you just made is the reason people think you are fucking stupid, not because of any of the other hilarious rationalizing you've offered up in this thread.
the problem is she thinks she's smarter than she actually is and after A SOLID FUCKING DECADE of attacks on xo she just tunes out anyone that provides a critique
for all the bashing she does of others for being mentally ill and narcissistic she should look in the mirror
Date: April 10th, 2012 8:43 PM Author: Beady-eyed Know-it-all State Hunting Ground
UVT. He is a USAMO megagenius, but he flamed out of grad school after a year, about to flame out of a super-prestigious job with the most prestigious corporation in the world.
With his masculine good looks and 6'3" muscular frame, he could be in movies or modeling in magazines, but instead he megapoasts on XO 24/7 calling people polisci shitheads.
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:07 PM Author: crusty business firm bbw
this thread almost makes me wish pensive were still around because he wouldn't be able to help himself from sock-puppeting it into a 200+ post disaster.
Date: April 10th, 2012 10:06 PM Author: Sienna startled space
btw everyone always accuses me of "making threads about blue smoke" but shouldn't the blame fall on all of the people responding to me rather than me? there are three posts by other posters to every post i make about myself
Date: April 10th, 2012 9:59 PM Author: silver forum
TBF. He wastes superhuman brilliance on angry screeds and pathetic thousand-post pissing contests. He should be curing cancer and inventing nanobots or at the very least Gobots