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Why do conturds want to DESTROY the middle class?

Make tuition so high and debt so much that we can't go to un...
zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann
  05/03/12
libs are the ones who loosened the student loan market, caus...
wonderful duck-like depressive locus
  05/03/12
just spend on defense instead of those things
blathering hall incel
  05/03/12
We spend twice as much on olds than we do on defense. You se...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
We still spend way too much on defense asshole.
zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann
  05/03/12
you seem like a retard. way to be completely ignorant about ...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
we still spend more than the next 20 biggest armies in the w...
zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann
  05/03/12
maybe because we provide defense for them as well? are you r...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
haha WHAT? wtf r u talking abt nigga that is not justific...
zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann
  05/03/12
% of GDP. look up our ranking you seem like a retard
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
and that doesnt include iraq and afghanistan costs or intere...
zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann
  05/03/12
so what % of that is part of the budget? look it up and get ...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
it was over a trillion dollars asshole.. if we hadnt done ei...
zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann
  05/03/12
Link?
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
google.com faggot
zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann
  05/03/12
Can't find the source. Link?
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
some of the spending on "olds" is actually defense...
Unholy Beady-eyed Meetinghouse Mad Cow Disease
  05/03/12
yea, and the amount of defense spending is UNDERSTATED becau...
zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann
  05/03/12
you seem retarded. http://jwheeler59.files.wordpress.com/...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
...
fighting chapel hairy legs
  05/03/12
your chart specifically "excludes Veteran's Benefits &a...
Unholy Beady-eyed Meetinghouse Mad Cow Disease
  05/03/12
what % of that is part of our budget? look it up and get pwn...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
http://www.va.gov/opa/pressrel/pressrelease.cfm?id=2263 W...
Unholy Beady-eyed Meetinghouse Mad Cow Disease
  05/03/12
That's less than 1% of our GDP. Are you dumb?
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
(conturd idiot bitching about 50 million for NPR while ignor...
zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann
  05/03/12
straw man
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
*complains about public broadcasting getting $25 million/yea...
Unholy Beady-eyed Meetinghouse Mad Cow Disease
  05/03/12
*uses straw man attacks after getting completely pwned* *...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
tcr
Splenetic Mischievous Kitty Party Of The First Part
  05/03/12
u are a dumbass
zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann
  05/03/12
oh great. the libtard can't accept facts so he resorts to ad...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
u arent even debating my point that spending more than the n...
zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann
  05/03/12
you're flame. we get it.
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
u know its possible we spend too much on defense AND too muc...
coral outnumbered hominid fortuitous meteor
  05/03/12
yes, and defense is leveling while olds are skyrocketing as ...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
guess what. if we spend too much on defense we spend too muc...
coral outnumbered hominid fortuitous meteor
  05/03/12
We spend more on the military than on all other discretionar...
racy stead new version
  05/03/12
nigga 180
zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann
  05/03/12
or maybe republicans would rather focus on increasing the ec...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
...
Burgundy Greedy Double Fault
  05/03/12
but dude GDP is rising and there are more ipads in existence...
Milky genital piercing plaza
  05/03/12
Maybe the singularity is really just one super-rich dude sit...
racy stead new version
  05/03/12
as long as GDP is increasing. u have a problem with lifting ...
Milky genital piercing plaza
  05/03/12
poverty is rapidly declining. why?
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
poverty where
Milky genital piercing plaza
  05/03/12
everywhere. poverty in the u.s. is relative, retard. the off...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
what makes you mentally unstable? do you stutter in real lif...
Milky genital piercing plaza
  05/03/12
really, bro. i'm trying to understand why our youth are so d...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
i'm trying to understand why youve posted the same thing 500...
Milky genital piercing plaza
  05/03/12
i'm trying to understand why our youth can be so dumb that t...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
i'm trying to understand how a psychotic mind works. why are...
Milky genital piercing plaza
  05/03/12
i'm trying to lean about the economic applicability of today...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
(retard who doesn't understand the significance of GDP) (...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
dude i love it when GDP increases
Milky genital piercing plaza
  05/03/12
hint: when the gdp is large, there is more to distribute ...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
o shit insane faggot alert
Milky genital piercing plaza
  05/03/12
seriously, what makes you economically dumb? did you major i...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
what makes you psychologically disturbed?
Milky genital piercing plaza
  05/03/12
no, really though. our youth have no concept of basic econom...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
really though, what specific mental disorders have you been ...
Milky genital piercing plaza
  05/03/12
really though, can you describe your favorite things you lea...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12
The worst thing about george20 is that he's completely humor...
white laughsome headpube
  05/03/12
yeah not funny and just a total shithead. has a pretty clear...
Milky genital piercing plaza
  05/03/12
xoxo libtard tactic: when pwned, resort to ad hominem att...
Arousing principal's office
  05/03/12


Poast new message in this thread



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:12 PM
Author: zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann

Make tuition so high and debt so much that we can't go to university and if we do we spend our life getting raped by loan payments.

Have no social safety net so we don't have healthcare if we lose our job.

We have no legal right to paid vacation, medical leave, maternity leave.

Decimate medicare and SS so that the private sector rapes us.

What else?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607505)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:42 PM
Author: wonderful duck-like depressive locus

libs are the ones who loosened the student loan market, causing tuition hikes

"decimate medicare and SS so that private sector rapes us"?

wtf does that even mean. SS is a pay as you go ponzi scheme that if run by anybody else would be illegal. Mandatory private ira's that are yours no matter what, are the only way to go.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607789)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:12 PM
Author: blathering hall incel

just spend on defense instead of those things

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607510)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:13 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

We spend twice as much on olds than we do on defense. You seem economically illiterate.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607515)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:14 PM
Author: zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann

We still spend way too much on defense asshole.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607524)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:19 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

you seem like a retard. way to be completely ignorant about our budget.

http://jwheeler59.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/defense-spending-trend.png

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607560)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:20 PM
Author: zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann

we still spend more than the next 20 biggest armies in the world faggot

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607570)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:21 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

maybe because we provide defense for them as well? are you retarded about our foreign policy?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607579)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:22 PM
Author: zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann

haha WHAT? wtf r u talking abt nigga

that is not justification for spending more than 20 countries COMBINED

we are just a militaristic nation u fucking turd

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607595)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:24 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

% of GDP. look up our ranking

you seem like a retard

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607611)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:20 PM
Author: zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann

and that doesnt include iraq and afghanistan costs or interest payments u stupid faggot or veterans benefits

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607577)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:21 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

so what % of that is part of the budget? look it up and get pwned.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607585)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:23 PM
Author: zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann

it was over a trillion dollars asshole.. if we hadnt done either war we would be in much better financial shape

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607599)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:26 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

Link?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607624)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:26 PM
Author: zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann

google.com faggot

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607628)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:27 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

Can't find the source. Link?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607631)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:15 PM
Author: Unholy Beady-eyed Meetinghouse Mad Cow Disease

some of the spending on "olds" is actually defense spending - VA costs, military pensions, etc.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607534)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:18 PM
Author: zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann

yea, and the amount of defense spending is UNDERSTATED because ppl dont factor in the interest costs on the national debt which are related to past ridiculous defense spending

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607551)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:20 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

you seem retarded.

http://jwheeler59.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/defense-spending-trend.png

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607565)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:20 PM
Author: fighting chapel hairy legs



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607576)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:20 PM
Author: Unholy Beady-eyed Meetinghouse Mad Cow Disease

your chart specifically "excludes Veteran's Benefits & Services"

fail. try again.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607578)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:22 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

what % of that is part of our budget? look it up and get pwned.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607590)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:23 PM
Author: Unholy Beady-eyed Meetinghouse Mad Cow Disease

http://www.va.gov/opa/pressrel/pressrelease.cfm?id=2263

WASHINGTON – With more than 1 million active-duty personnel scheduled to join the ranks of America’s 22 million Veterans during the next five years, the President has proposed a $140.3 billion budget for the Department of Veterans Affairs for the fiscal year beginning Oct. 1.

and that's just the VA.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607598)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:25 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

That's less than 1% of our GDP. Are you dumb?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607622)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:27 PM
Author: zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann

(conturd idiot bitching about 50 million for NPR while ignorin trillions wasted on military)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607633)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:28 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

straw man

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607644)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:27 PM
Author: Unholy Beady-eyed Meetinghouse Mad Cow Disease

*complains about public broadcasting getting $25 million/year*

*brushes aside $140 billion/year as insignificant*

*licks eyeball*

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607635)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:27 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

*uses straw man attacks after getting completely pwned*

*is a retard*

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607640)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:04 PM
Author: Splenetic Mischievous Kitty Party Of The First Part

tcr

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607972)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:21 PM
Author: zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann

u are a dumbass

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607580)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:22 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

oh great. the libtard can't accept facts so he resorts to ad hominem attacks.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607596)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:23 PM
Author: zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann

u arent even debating my point that spending more than the next 20 biggest armies COMBINED is ridiculous and is not justifiable by ur allegation that we have to protect them. Ha, we protect China, Russia, India? Wtf r u talknig abt nigga

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607604)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:26 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

you're flame. we get it.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607627)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:56 PM
Author: coral outnumbered hominid fortuitous meteor

u know its possible we spend too much on defense AND too much on olds??

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607891)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:01 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

yes, and defense is leveling while olds are skyrocketing as more boomers retire. you seem economically dumb.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607938)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:04 PM
Author: coral outnumbered hominid fortuitous meteor

guess what. if we spend too much on defense we spend too much on defense even if we need to cut even moar from the olds budget.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607963)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:36 PM
Author: racy stead new version

We spend more on the military than on all other discretionary programs combined.

And reptiles don't really want to cut Medicare or Social Security because, ya know, they would never win another election.

So they want to cut taxes (ostensibly on everyone...but the cuts do not help the poorest Americans who pay no tax, do little to help Americans between the 30-70%tile of earners, and disproportionately benefit the wealthy) and cut "welfare."

Except that "welfare" in the traditional sense of the word hardly exist anymore. And safety-net programs, which provide a little cash assistance to certain families with children but primarily fund food-stamps, housing assistance, school lunches, child-care, help with heating in the winter and so on, now only account for about an 1/8th of the federal budget. There isn't much to cut. So reptiles end up being as reckless fiscally as the Democrats, but they are proud of the fact that they don't do anything to make the world a better place while spending all that money.

tl;dr Republicans don't want to destroy the middle class, per se. In fact, they would probably rather not. Ya know, Eisenhower or whatever. But their desire to keep rich people as rich as possible, to make USA "special" and to make being poor in our country as undignified and terrible as possible just kind of has that collateral effect.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607728)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:39 PM
Author: zombie-like vibrant range boltzmann

nigga 180

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607752)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:00 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

or maybe republicans would rather focus on increasing the economic pie for everybody, even if that means there are larger income gaps? would you rather have a poor poorer as long as the income gap is decreased?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607931)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:10 PM
Author: Burgundy Greedy Double Fault



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20608018)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:44 PM
Author: Milky genital piercing plaza

but dude GDP is rising and there are more ipads in existence than any other time in human history

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607815)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:51 PM
Author: racy stead new version

Maybe the singularity is really just one super-rich dude sitting on the top of a mountain of a billion ipads while everyone else left alive slowly starves to death thousands of feet below.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607863)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:56 PM
Author: Milky genital piercing plaza

as long as GDP is increasing. u have a problem with lifting venusians out of poverty?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607897)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:58 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

poverty is rapidly declining. why?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607908)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:03 PM
Author: Milky genital piercing plaza

poverty where

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607951)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:04 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

everywhere. poverty in the u.s. is relative, retard. the official world poverty line is $1-2 per day. what makes you dumb?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607970)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:05 PM
Author: Milky genital piercing plaza

what makes you mentally unstable? do you stutter in real life?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607977)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:06 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

really, bro. i'm trying to understand why our youth are so dumb. did you major in women's studies or photography?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607987)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:07 PM
Author: Milky genital piercing plaza

i'm trying to understand why youve posted the same thing 5000 times. must be ocd?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607994)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:08 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

i'm trying to understand why our youth can be so dumb that they can't grasp very simple economic principles. do you think your class on Anglo-American Pedagogy was worth it?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20608001)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:10 PM
Author: Milky genital piercing plaza

i'm trying to understand how a psychotic mind works. why are you constantly mad? is it childhood trauma or is it purely neurogenic?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20608026)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:13 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

i'm trying to lean about the economic applicability of today's youths. can you tell me more about your Renaissance to Romanticism powerpoint slides?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20608049)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 7:59 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

(retard who doesn't understand the significance of GDP)

(is economically illiterate)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607925)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:02 PM
Author: Milky genital piercing plaza

dude i love it when GDP increases

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607947)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:03 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

hint: when the gdp is large, there is more to distribute

what makes you an idiot?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607954)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:04 PM
Author: Milky genital piercing plaza

o shit insane faggot alert

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607967)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:04 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

seriously, what makes you economically dumb? did you major in art history?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607973)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:05 PM
Author: Milky genital piercing plaza

what makes you psychologically disturbed?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607982)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:07 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

no, really though. our youth have no concept of basic economic principles. do you think your $300,000 expenditure for your art history degree was worth it?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607992)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:08 PM
Author: Milky genital piercing plaza

really though, what specific mental disorders have you been diagnosed with? ocd is one i think. bipolar? aspergers perhaps

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20607997)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:12 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

really though, can you describe your favorite things you learned in your "British Romanticism and Italian Renaissance Art" course?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20608040)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:19 PM
Author: white laughsome headpube

The worst thing about george20 is that he's completely humorless. Worst poster ever

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20608099)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:23 PM
Author: Milky genital piercing plaza

yeah not funny and just a total shithead. has a pretty clear mental disorder

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20608125)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 3rd, 2012 8:35 PM
Author: Arousing principal's office

xoxo libtard tactic:

when pwned, resort to ad hominem attacks.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1939617&forum_id=2#20608205)