The most prestigious law school admissions discussion board in the world.
|
 |
 
|
Class Rank for WUSTL BIGLAW
Poast new message in this thread
Date: November 14th, 2008 1:06 AM Author: heady violet gay wizard what class rank for BIGLAW from WUSTL?
how bout BIGLAW for NY? CA? |
Date: November 14th, 2008 3:24 AM Author: heady violet gay wizard bump (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10360147) |
|
Date: November 14th, 2008 6:09 AM Author: Swashbuckling Domesticated Legend Theater Stage obvious flame (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10360190) |
 |
Date: November 14th, 2008 4:44 PM Author: heady violet gay wizard not a flame. people on this board bash on WUSTL but in the 2005 NLJ250 employment chart they had a higher percentage in NLJ250 firms than GW and USC. just curious what class rank for any BIGLAW and for NY/CA BIGLAW. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10361279) |
|
Date: November 15th, 2008 11:54 AM Author: milky clown For NYC Biglaw: top 25% for a shot (maybe higher IN THIS ECONOMY).
For CA Biglaw: top 10%, and OCI probably won't help...you'll have to do it on your own. Seriously. WUSTL just doesn't have any sort of a presence on the West Coast. |
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 5:23 AM Author: heady violet gay wizard thanks. isn't WUSTL a respectable T20 though?
top 25% for NYC biglaw seems harsh
top 10% for CA biglaw seems harsh too
i guess going to a T2 school like Loyola or Pepperdine would be a better choice for CA biglaw then.
|
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 10:35 AM Author: deranged sable antidepressant drug (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10367103) |
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 11:41 AM Author: Motley indirect expression mediation typically the school's own students swoop in to answer school-specific questions like these, often inflating the class rank.
I think 25%-30% is a fair estimate for those who have the opportunity to interview for NY biglaw; if you want to be assured ny biglaw (let's call thisV50 and below), however, you will need 10-15%.
WUSTL's employment stats are buoyed by chicago biglaw, for which wustl has few competitors (ND, U of C, NU, UMich), and bryan cave. when interacting with the real world wustl students confront an awful reality--that aside from wustl students and USNews, nobody considers WUSTL undergraduate and non-medicine graduate programs more highly than those of U of Illinois. |
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 12:02 PM Author: pea-brained offensive psychic box office I don't know anyone who didn't get BIGLAW in NY (who wanted it) with top 20%. But beyond that (i.e. 20-33%), it was a crap shoot; some people got a few decent offers others not only didn't get NY, they got literally nothing.
Below top 33% is pretty much screwed for legit BIGLAW.
And this was several years ago, obv, not IN THIS ECONOMY. |
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 5:25 PM Author: heady violet gay wizard top 20% for NY biglaw?
for a school with a median LSAT of 167, that's pathetic.
no WUSTL for me then. seems like Tulane, Hastings, UIUC have better biglaw placement |
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 8:35 PM Author: heady violet gay wizard when you guys say biglaw. do you mean V100 or NLJ250 or AmLaw? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10369340) |
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 8:40 PM Author: Titillating Institution Tulane does NOT have better placement. Hastings does better on the West Coast, but is unknown everywhere else. UIUC places well in Chicago but that's it.
|
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 8:53 PM Author: heady violet gay wizard some Tulane 2Ls have said top 30% can get biglaw or market from Tulane. that seems better than top 25% for NYC biglaw and top 10% for west coast.
are you a WUSTL student? |
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 8:58 PM Author: bateful arrogant lay The Tulane trolls are the worst. I stopped going to LSD, but there was this loser there who would spam over and over about how fucking great Tulane is. You might have heard this from the same person.
Check out the NLJ 250 placement study and that should quickly debunk the notion that top 30% at Tulane get biglaw. |
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 9:26 PM Author: Motley indirect expression mediation at some point you have to face that for most schools, biglaw in competitive markets is guaranteed only to the top 15%. By biglaw, I'm referring to those massive firms between which associates can move with relative ease.
Distinctions like v20 vs. v50 are all quite obvioulsy meaningless. An associate can move from a firm like milbank to a firm like latham and vice versa. You don't get recruiting calls, however, for placement at a few firms (cravath and i haven't heard of anyone getting them from STB/sullcrom) or for placements at a few boutiques (wachtell, mto, etc).
yet distinctions among schools are quite meaningful. if we look beyond the t14, ucla, usc, ut, and vanderbilt all have good enough placement that top third gets some form of biglaw with top half getting some interviews, though students towards the lower end of these ranges will be more restricted in market choice.
fordham and GW are top 25% with top half getting some interviews at lower-ranked biglaw firms (e.g., chadbourne, thelen, tpw).
other schools in this range (wustl, minnesota, ND) are more regional, and while students at the top (think 5%) have biglaw in their market of choice, top 25% does not guarantee biglaw. students touting the school's party line cite placement stats qualified by "for anyone who wanted it," revealing an ignorance of how effectively pride shapes desire. penn is a top 6 law school and white & case is a white shoe international law behemoth, as it goes. but how can a "top 20" law school guarantee only 15% of its graduates biglaw?
1) USNews rankings are worthless. there are the top 14-17 or so schools; there are GW and fordham; there are a bunch of schools that place 15-20% of their students in biglaw; there are a bunch that place 10%; and then there are a ton that place far far less.
2) wustl was never a top 20 school before last year. furthermore, nobody cares whether wustl has jumped ohio state and iowa to place higher on a meaningless portion of the usnews rankings than it had two years prior.
3) if you can't get into one of those top 14-17 schools, decide where to attend based on a combination of the following:
a-how the school feeds into your home market (tied as most important) b-where you think you can do well (e.g., SMU is insanely competitive) c-affordability (tied as most important) |
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 9:34 PM Author: Wonderful Gaming Laptop This is one of the finest and most incisive comments on this topic I have ever read. A heartfelt 180. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10369577) |
|
Date: November 17th, 2008 10:08 PM Author: deranged sable antidepressant drug (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10372801) |
|
Date: November 19th, 2008 9:46 AM Author: mint boiling water resort not to be a turdsandwich, but this is a gem in the siberian rough that is xoxo career advice. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10377035) |
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 9:05 PM Author: gay round eye That's fucking retarded. Less than 10% of Tulane will pull market in any city.
Click on the composite report to see the numbers: http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNLJ.jsp?id=900005508582
Tulane places about as well as shitholes like University of Houston. They're probably the next best example to Washington U. in terms of people mistakenly thinking the law school is good because the medical program is decent and people recognize the undergrad name.
A few from Tulane get Biglaw in NYC, but that's because they're returning home to work (many NE Jews who couldn't get into legit law schools head south for Tulane) and are either connected or have been gunning for NYC throughout law school. Tulane's median LSAT is struggling to stay over 160, despite the fact that they're throwing huge scholarships to anybody with over 164 or so -- they're a TTT impostor and their placement is virtually indistinguishable from most T2 privates. |
|
Date: November 17th, 2008 7:09 PM Author: heady violet gay wizard if you add clerkships. maybe that brings the 10% up to 15-20% for Tulane (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10372319) |
|
Date: November 17th, 2008 7:30 PM Author: Wonderful Gaming Laptop Look at Tulane's clerking placements and numbers - they fucking suck. Coif at Tulane can get one or two market jobs around the Gulf Coast and a few in NYC who are returning home (as was mentioned). After that, maybe top quarter can get Midlaw-ish positions around the area, but nothing fancy. And we're talking about the SE, so these jobs are more like $65K than $85K. They don't have a home market and the alumni are scattered.
Tulane having 'good placement' is one of the greatest law school myths, and it has been capably debunked on this site and elsewhere, many times. It's a pricey T2 party school masquerading as a T1. Just look at the fucking medians, which they had to slash a hundred kids out of recent class sizes to maintain. Barely 160 LSAT + getting equaled or beat by professional powerhouses like U. of Tennessee (lol) = a shitty, overpriced school. |
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 9:51 PM Author: Twinkling milk stage Take this thread with a grain of salt. WUSTL placement is not that bad.
|
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 9:59 PM Author: Motley indirect expression mediation FOR THOSE WHO WANTED IT (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10369740) |
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 10:22 PM Author: heady violet gay wizard do you have anything to prove otherwise? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10369876) |
|
Date: November 16th, 2008 10:28 PM Author: cowardly useless brakes persian I banged a true 10 asian in the ass last night.
Do you have any evidence to prove otherwise? |
|
Date: November 17th, 2008 1:28 AM Author: heady violet gay wizard thanks guys
looks like i won't be doing the WUSTL |
|
Date: November 17th, 2008 7:13 PM Author: Rambunctious abusive degenerate lol @ this thread
Bottom line is that you need to rank fucking high, so work your ass off.
Or just go to a better school. |
|
Date: November 17th, 2008 9:13 PM Author: fiercely-loyal locale Subject: you people are idiots I'm a 2L at WUSTL. Almost everyone I know in my class has a job at a bigger firm. Now, maybe I only know people in the top half, but I know tons of people going to Chicago, D.C., NYC, and Boston. I don't know many going to San Fran. or L.A.
You can all suck it. We did just fine. I knew people who were top 20% with 5-10 callbacks at top NYC and Chicago firms. |
|
Date: November 17th, 2008 9:40 PM Author: Twinkling milk stage titcr. WUSTL placement has improved substantially over the past few years. Syverud has done, and is doing, impressive things. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10372735) |
|
Date: November 17th, 2008 10:13 PM Author: stirring metal philosopher-king I know a girl who just graduated from WUSTL this past May, is unemployed, and didn't pass the bar. She's a skank too. She seems to be under the impression that most of her classmates don't have jobs either. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10372813) |
|
Date: November 17th, 2008 10:20 PM Author: deranged sable antidepressant drug (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10372844) |
|
Date: November 17th, 2008 10:22 PM Author: slippery preventive strike Life is fine at teh Fordham of the Mississippi. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10372857) |
|
Date: November 17th, 2008 10:29 PM Author: fiercely-loyal locale It refers to the firms that recruit during fall OCI, moron. They range from huge (DLA) to medium-ish (150-200 lawyers). (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10372883) |
|
Date: November 17th, 2008 10:30 PM Author: deranged sable antidepressant drug (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10372890) |
|
Date: November 17th, 2008 10:39 PM Author: fiercely-loyal locale Whoops - sorry. Hardly ever post here. I will repeat:
Not sure how you've refuted or even challenged anything I said about WUSTL. If you have an issue, give me something coherent and I'll try to respond as best I can. |
|
Date: November 17th, 2008 10:36 PM Author: fiercely-loyal locale Not sure how you've refuted or even challenged anything I said about WUSTL. If you have an issue, give me something coherent and I'll try to respond as best I can. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10372898) |
|
Date: November 18th, 2008 3:24 AM Author: heady violet gay wizard what class rank from WUSTL for just a 6-figure salary that's not necessarily biglaw then? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10373694) |
|
Date: November 18th, 2008 10:56 AM Author: sooty supple nursing home genital piercing "One time, four years ago, a magazine survey that excludes clerkships from its employment placement statistics places us ahead of two peer schools."
Of course, this being 2008, I suppose you don't mind citing this year's: http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNLJ.jsp?id=1207904889529
Of the top 20, Yale is ranked 20th. Of course, that's because Yale places a lot of people in clerkships. And WUSTL doesn't place in the top 20 for that, so maybe they send a lot out to clerk.
http://lawclerkaddict2009.blogspot.com/2008/09/percentage-of-clerks-by-school.html
http://lawclerkaddict2008.blogspot.com/2007/09/percentage-of-clerks-by-school.html
Well, okay, maybe they don't send a lot of people to the NLJ 250 or to clerk at the federal court of appeals, but maybe they clerk elsewhere.
http://pdfserver.amlaw.com/nlj/20080414employment_trends.pdf
Hm, that's funny, it looks like they just send a lot of grads to "other firms." Maybe other elite firms?
http://www.leiterrankings.com/jobs/2008job_biglaw.shtml
Geez, not there either. Where DO they go? I mean, they're a top-20 body in terms of student quality, right?
http://www.leiterrankings.com/students/2008student_quality.shtml
Wow. I wonder how their US News rank gets up there, then?
http://leiterlawschool.typepad.com/leiter/2006/09/top_20_law_scho.html
Oh, yes, spending account for a portion of the US News rankings. How silly of me.
http://leiterlawschool.typepad.com/leiter/2008/06/schools-that-ta.html
Oh, and transfers, too.
Well, let's see where the grads go. Obviously, even though it's in Missouri, it's so prestigious that its grads would only look to Illinois and New York, and perhaps California.
http://officialguide.lsac.org/SearchResults/SchoolPage.aspx?sid=166
Hm, 75 grads in a class of 221 take the Missouri bar. Well, maybe that's normal. Maybe a lot of Yale kids take the Connecticut bar.
http://officialguide.lsac.org/SearchResults/SchoolPage.aspx?sid=177
Well, I guess not. Maybe a lot of Michigan students take the Michigan bar?
http://officialguide.lsac.org/SearchResults/SchoolPage.aspx?sid=88
Huh. Do a lot of Notre Dame grads take the Indiana bar?
http://officialguide.lsac.org/SearchResults/SchoolPage.aspx?sid=109
Guess not.
Well, I bet a lot of New York firms still come to visit WUSTL.
http://www.nalpdirectory.com/dledir_search_advanced.asp
15! That looks impressive!
...but why do 68 New York firms visit GWU? Why do 31 New York firms visit USC? Why do 27 visit Notre Dame? Why do 36 visit Emory?
Well, 11 visit Minnesota, 9 visit Illinois, 7 visit Iowa. I guess that makes it better. |
|
Date: November 18th, 2008 6:04 PM Author: soul-stirring spruce principal's office legal warrant nice work (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10374937) |
|
Date: November 18th, 2008 8:17 PM Author: Misanthropic embarrassed to the bone community account rigpig excellent work. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10375323) |
|
Date: November 18th, 2008 8:24 PM Author: Motley indirect expression mediation bravo good sir (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10375341) |
|
Date: November 18th, 2008 9:50 PM Author: fiercely-loyal locale What a stupid post.
Let's see.... a) this list shows exactly what is going on: http://pdfserver.amlaw.com/nlj/20080414employment_trends.pdf about the same # of WUSTL grades go to NLJ 250 firms as GW, UT and UCLA. b) the Michigan ABA stats page doesn't list the # of students who take the MI bar. c) the Notre Dame ABA stats likewise doesn't list the # of students who take the IN bar. d) the WUSTL students who don't have jobs often take the MO bar and are stuck in MO; hence, a large # take the MO bar.
Again, a vast majority of my classmates who wanted to go to NYC, DC, Chicago and Boston who were top half have jobs at biglaw firms there. |
|
Date: November 18th, 2008 10:31 PM Author: Wonderful Gaming Laptop This is quite possibly the weakest come-back to a devastating post I've ever seen. You would have done better by poor old WUSTL by just letting the thread sink rather than instigating another round of lulz from the whole world by suggesting that the VAST majority of your classmates actually have access to jobs in DC, Boston, or really any market outside of the Midwest.
"the Michigan ABA stats page doesn't list the # of students who take the MI bar"
LOL. You're right dude - Michigan grads are all gunning for BIGDETROITLAW and really want to stick around the state. I heard their alumni network is really strong there. No doubt at least a 1/3 of them CHOOSE to stay in Michigan for this reason, just like a 1/3 of WUSTL grads really want to practice law in Missouri. They're practically peer schools. |
|
Date: November 18th, 2008 11:05 PM Author: heady violet gay wizard although i am now convinced that schools outside of the T15 are TTT for biglaw placement, especially since most cost the same as T14s, i will concede that the newest US News has most WUSTL students taking the bar in IL instead of MO (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10375843) |
|
Date: November 19th, 2008 9:21 AM Author: lavender bull headed ticket booth Maybe so, but still - 30% of WUSTL grads take the bar in fucking Missouri. And most of the rest don't get far - Illinois. The school simply has no reach. That 30% figure is horrifying. There isn't exactly an abundance of sweet jobs in St. Louis and KC. The school has no market and stands in line behind notoriously overrated schools like Notre Dame for second tier Chicago Biglaw.
WUSTL has been tapping their financial resources to buy high LSAT scores, plain and simple. Without throwing around the scholarships, they're ranked back in the 30s and not even prominent enough to warrant mockery. Without the scholarships and slightly pumped numbers from Bryan Cave, they're the Wake Forest of the Midwest.
If your goal is Midlaw in the school's tiny region of influence or maybe, if you're lucky, shitty Biglaw in Chicago, then WUSTL won't disappoint. The trolls on here claiming that 'everybody they know who wanted Biglaw in DC or NYC got offers if they were top half' need to just fuck off and die with those ridiculous lies. |
|
Date: November 19th, 2008 8:44 AM Author: sooty supple nursing home genital piercing teh lulz (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=880719&forum_id=2#10376938) |