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How long do BIGLAW partners who aren't billing last?
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 5:08 PM Author: Unholy newt alpha (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48954513) |
Date: May 22nd, 2025 5:11 PM Author: seedy bat shit crazy trailer park If they are originating, forever (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48954521) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 5:12 PM Author: Unholy newt alpha what about the "proliferators" (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48954523) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 5:14 PM Author: Crystalline depressive depends, if they have a book they can just manage that forever and if they hand it off slowly as they age they can stick around a long ass time if the firm doesn't have mandatory retirement, I knew one dood who was 87 and there is no way he billed more than an hour a day but presumably there where still some old clients who liked to hear from him on the phone (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48954533) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 5:16 PM Author: Unholy newt alpha I'm more talking about junior partners not originators. just people who run cases for firm clients or pitch cases to firm clients but then they get slow.
I know a few who are billing 0 hours right now. They do a lot of firm committees and internal shit but I bet they've billed less than 100 hours over the past 6 months. |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 5:31 PM Author: Crystalline depressive they are all fucked very hard in the ass (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48954627) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 5:32 PM Author: Bearded resort Cr. No way they last another year. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48954630) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 5:36 PM Author: exhilarant cowardly gas station How is that possible (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48954644) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 7:26 PM Author: sepia garrison BIGLAW gets rid of people very slowly. You first get a warning, then some time to fix problem, then get asked to leave, then get 6 months. there are people who make entire careers out of hopping firms every 2 years. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48954910) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 10:00 PM Author: Useless Impertinent Rehab This is credited. Believe it or not, firms generally don’t want to fire people and when they do (barring something egregious—fucking the cleaning lady) they’re very slow to do it and they will try to position the person for success somewhere else, especially if they’re a senior associate / junior partner. And there are people who take advantage of this dynamic and flip from firm to firm. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48955186) |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 5:13 PM Author: brilliant sanctuary cr. this is why ite was such a big deal got law. lathaming is not something that happens outside of a crisis. most firms retained as many people as they could afford and just stopped hiring, so 2011+ grads got turbofucked.
biglaw is designed as a pyramid scheme where associates are pumped for hours with only a fraction making it long term. the ones that leave go off to other prestigious careers where they do bizdev by sending the firm biz or just being prestigious and making the firm look good. so of course firms want to give them a soft landing and cultivate good post-biglaw relations. |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 5:18 PM Author: razzle-dazzle whorehouse sound barrier (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48956956) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 5:37 PM Author: Bateful confused brethren sounds like women/URMs -- 0 billiables and a bunch of internal bullshit (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48954647) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 9:55 PM Author: Useless Impertinent Rehab These people are all going to get fired if they stay and half of them are likely already looking for new jobs but you just don’t know it. Firms hate paying for nonproductive service partners.
I’ve seen otherwise good doods (talking well liked, good track record, consistent performers) have an “off year” of 1000/1200/1400 or whatever because of some combo of bad luck or bad timing and they survive. Note even in that off year they were hustling, doing biz. dev., had concrete explanations for why shit didn’t work out. But I’ve never seen someone literally putting in 0/near 0 months month after month not either get shitcanned or leave. |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 10:00 PM Author: arousing ticket booth doctorate If you are, let's say, a black woman, would this be possible to get away with? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48955185) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 10:02 PM Author: Soul-stirring Shrine Not any more. Once DEI died, everyone shit canned the minorities. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48955189) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 10:03 PM Author: Useless Impertinent Rehab Not in my experience. You might be able to get away with turning in those 1000/1200/1400 years while doing 1000 hours of diversity shit but firms won’t tolerate paying someone in excess of 500k as a pure cost center.
What I have seen happen is they’ll sometimes get offered some sort of minimized or non billing role like a knowledge manage attorney or diversity officer or some shit like that. It usually comes with a pay cut but they’re no longer under billing pressure either. |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 10:17 PM Author: Soul-stirring Shrine Even at 1000 hours you are break even. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48955211) |
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Date: May 22nd, 2025 11:07 PM Author: sepia garrison right but that's what he's saying. if you have one terrible year (and I consider 1000 terrible) that might be OK if you have a long history and it's just an off year.
but billing 0 per month and maybe 500 for the year is not acceptable. |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 4:51 PM Author: Trip Mexican Why would someone only bill 1000 hours in a year? That is ridiculous. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48956893) |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 5:17 PM Author: brilliant sanctuary wdym? most people want to work as little as possible and without incentives will do the least they can get away with (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48956950) |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 5:18 PM Author: Trip Mexican If you are a lawyer, you should act like it. I have 859.2 billables entered so far this year and 78 non-billable. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48956959) |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 5:21 PM Author: brilliant sanctuary proud if u but that doesnt change the fact people will avoid doing what they "should do" without incentives. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48956968) |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 6:05 PM Author: Trip Mexican Lawyers shouldn't do that. Those people should be disbarred and put in gas chambers. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48957099) |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 9:53 PM Author: Bearded resort Ur honor, it’s Christmas! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48957697) |
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Date: May 24th, 2025 9:57 AM Author: Soul-stirring Shrine If you do M&A and M&A dries up you are lucky to bill 1000 hours a year, especially at the partner level where you are working on primarily your own clients. Same with some other groups. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48958232) |
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Date: May 24th, 2025 10:42 AM Author: Trip Mexican Work on other stuff then. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48958327) |
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Date: May 24th, 2025 11:40 AM Author: Soul-stirring Shrine I don’t think people remember ITE. It’s not like a corporate lawyer could do securities fraud litigation. Yes, maybe you could pick up some transactional work in a bankruptcy, but there was not enough of that to go around so you had M&A guys billing like 25 hours a month. Then they got Lathamed into a market with no jobs. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48958449) |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 7:47 AM Author: Talented Menage Roommate Even 15 years ago DEI partners could get by on 1k hours. Can’t imagine they’re held to a higher standard now. I was able to view everyone’s hours then and could see that some DEI partners would bill like 1100 hours with 400 coming from taking two minor depos in a sprawling class action suit (and of course they had someone else draft their outlines). (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48955729) |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 6:15 PM Author: provocative brass church The realization of a lot of these people is pathetically low. At my firm I see every timekeeper’s billed time monthly, but realizations/collections are a state secret. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48957126) |
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Date: May 24th, 2025 10:54 AM Author: Talented Menage Roommate No doubt. I suspect billings won’t raise an issue if they see that the lawyer’s time being written off is a DEI hire. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48958351) |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 10:02 AM Author: startled fanboi station How is it possible to bill 0 hours in a month? You’d have to be actively trying to avoid doing work. I’d say there is at least 50 hours a month of just random follow on shit from past deals that I’d have to deal with in any given month. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48955921) |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 7:48 AM Author: khaki karate RSF is still listed as a partner going on ten years now (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48955730) |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 8:06 AM Author: stubborn telephone background story If you are a service partner making $500K and billing $1000 hour, even at 1000 hours they will keep you if your “service” is niche at all. You can expect a hefty bonus if you make it up to 1500.
It also depend on who you are servicing. If your rainmaker has an $8m+ book but needs your “service” then even at 1K hours you’re very valuable. If you’re just doing fungible work then it’s different.
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 10:03 AM Author: Razzle Forum Goal In Life depends on what the partnership contract says. it used to be forever. now its not long. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48955924) |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 5:00 PM Author: Abusive costumed crackhouse coffee pot 2 to 3 years (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48956915) |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 6:12 PM Author: provocative brass church Cr. This is true for equity partners at most firms.
The true rainmakers are fine, the true service partners are fine if they’re billing (might be 1600 or 1900 or something else - very practice area dependent), it’s the hybrid guys without a self-sustaining book and yet who also aren’t really working - they usually have a couple of years to get it together, and they never do, but they’ll bounce one rung down the AmLaw ladder and can do this forever until they end up at a local firm making $275k. |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 10:09 PM Author: Saffron university half-breed My old V5 firm had a policy of cutting equity partners pay 50% each year. They didn’t hit their quota until they were down to like making 100,000 and then they were forced to go after that. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48957729) |
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Date: May 23rd, 2025 10:51 PM Author: sepia garrison LOL wut... what V5 equity partners are really making 100,000. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5728918&forum_id=2...id.#48957789) |