The most prestigious law school admissions discussion board in the world.
|
 |
 
|
Just finished 60 day water fast. Taking questions
Poast new message in this thread
Date: April 5th, 2018 11:14 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit Outside of family and a few friends no one knows I lost weight by fasting. Been telling people vague stuff like I cut out carbs, eat less etc (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35768982) |
 |
Date: April 5th, 2018 11:20 AM Author: insecure office how did you break the fast? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35769026) |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 11:25 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit 1 day of just bone broth, then added steamed veggies for 2 days (spinach then mixed brocolli/cauliflower/carrots), then added fermented foods like pickles/kefir which is where I'm currently at. Going to add more stuff over the next few days like eggs, meat etc (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35769084) |
|
Date: April 9th, 2018 1:13 PM Author: heady rambunctious market Try SPERMBLAST to STIM your CUMDUMPSTER (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35798737) |
Date: April 5th, 2018 11:15 AM Author: electric mustard indirect expression Describe the regime (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35768987) |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 11:17 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit just drank a lot of water. occasionally took a multivitamin but don't really think I needed to. also occasionally put a bit of salt in the water. |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 11:15 AM Author: Motley doobsian travel guidebook Weight before and after? Hardest part? Did you experience hyper-clarity? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35768988) |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 11:23 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit went from 320 to 260, so still a long way to go. hardest part fasting-wise was the first few days, then it was smooth sailing. It was surprisingly easier than I thought it would be. I probably could have kept going but was still cooking for my son and starting getting more into cooking, learning new recipes, etc and just wanted to eat again. Towards the end it was annoying for lack of a better word on a couple occasions being around food. No I wouldn't call it hyper-clarity, though I would describe being in a fat adapted state as having a very steady level of energy all day |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 11:26 AM Author: Motley doobsian travel guidebook Nice! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35769095) |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 11:19 AM Author: Concupiscible parlor Dumb to do this without protein or lifting. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35769019) |
|
Date: May 27th, 2018 12:22 PM Author: salmon out-of-control degenerate (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36135736) |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 11:20 AM Author: ocher angry property philosopher-king flame (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35769024) |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 11:27 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit back to answer q's in an hour (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35769102) |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 11:28 AM Author: Disrespectful vermilion hominid this is the credited approach for overweight people your body is built to survive on fat stores. as long as you take vitamin C, you can safely fast indefinitely, until you lose your excess fat, at a documented rate of about 300lbs a year. there are lots of studies on this proving it is safe. but they don't publicize them, instead promoting 'It's Impossible For Fat People Ever to Lose Weight Because Magic' |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 1:22 PM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit I don't remember exactly when the idea first got in my head but it may have been the harper's fasting article that was posted here. Then I read a book called The Obesity Code by Jason Fung. Made me realize the only way to lose weight over the long term was to lower insulin, and fasting is the best way to do this. If I could do it again I'd get a before/after blood test to see what changed (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35770093) |
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 11:48 AM Author: Galvanic Prole Striped Hyena Xo JasonFung (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36111513) |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 11:31 AM Author: khaki vivacious nibblets 180 bro
longest one I've done was 5 days
did you do shorter ones before or did you start w the 60 day one right off the bat? |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 12:56 PM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit Yes good point, I did do shorter fasts first. Was definitely necessary to be able to do this one. First was 8 days so kind of long as far as first fasts go. It was a good experience though I didn't end it very well (think I had some chipotle) so had a mild case of the runs. This was about 6 months ago. I did a couple 3-5 day ones a few months ago but that was it until this recent one. |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 1:04 PM Author: khaki vivacious nibblets nice man
yea for me biggest issue was always ending them, i always get the runs.
but the feeling by day 3 is always 180
you gonna do more really long ones? |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 1:09 PM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit Yeah I think I'll probably get a good couple months of good eating habits under my belt then do another long one. Probably not 60 days but maybe something like 2 weeks. I'll play it by ear. I have to say I really did enjoy it and I'm already starting to miss it and not really like the feeling of having food in my stomach. But that's probably related to my stomach just getting used to food again even though I am taking it slow this time (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35769959) |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 1:46 AM Author: khaki vivacious nibblets did you think going in you were gonna do 60 days? or a week/2 weeks and you just kept going? what made you push it to 60? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35776017) |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 2:00 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit You know it’s actually kind of hard to remember because I played it by ear and kept changing my mind but I think at the start I wanted to do at least a month. There were a few times I thought I could just keep going for 3 or even 4 months but it came down to simple boredom (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35776053) |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 2:04 AM Author: khaki vivacious nibblets interesting. for me weekdays doing fasts is a breeze. i did mon-fri 5 day fast a few times. and some 3-4 day ones. but going into the weekend fasting is brutal, cuz theres no work distraction, hard not to think about food a lot.
did you drink alcohol at all? go out at all? what did you do for entertainment |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 2:13 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit Yeah it’s definitely harder on the weekend. And for me at least I was cooking every day for my son. I did go out a few times and also jam with some buddies but didn’t do any drinking. Smoked a decent amount of reefer though. That part was interesting- for 20 years I’ve without fail associated weed with eating. College roommates even made fun of me for walking in the door with fast food but setting it down to go smoke first. I feel like I’ve almost disassociated the 2 now |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 1:04 PM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit I think after the first couple tries I realized I liked fasting and could do it fairly easily but that didn't really affect my unhealthy relationship with food when I wasn't fasting. I worked on that in the couple months prior to starting this fast. I've also heard that a fast of this length can be very good for sort of 'resetting' how you look at food so I'm hoping that turns out to be true. So far it's been pretty interesting. Eating again has been sort of uneventful. It's hard to describe. This will probably change over the next week or so as my appetite comes back (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35769925) |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 11:32 AM Author: Cream Trailer Park Coldplay Fan good flame bro (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35769171) |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 1:04 PM Author: cracking hospital affirmative action very cr have more or less done this for a while. life hack: just add some clean no carb calories from whiskey to extend indefinitely. very cr for overall health and life expectancy afaik (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35769916) |
|
Date: April 9th, 2018 1:06 PM Author: Bateful trump supporter lol (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35798706) |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 1:05 PM Author: spruce gaped twinkling uncleanness Seems pretty gratuitous.
Longest I've made it is 13 days on the Master Cleanse. Went from 181 to 159. |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 1:13 PM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit I can see how people would think it's overkill but keep in mind I was 320 lbs. I've heard really long fasts are easier the heavier you are and this was true for me. 13 days is a lot for someone 181 lbs, what did you think of the experience? |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 1:45 PM Author: spruce gaped twinkling uncleanness It was fine after 3 days. Didn't miss food at all. Only time I felt tired was when I'd go for a run or try to lift weights (which was stupid). I felt great at the end of it. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35770316) |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 1:11 PM Author: Histrionic faggot firefighter legal warrant next time make it 90! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35769977) |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 2:36 PM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit figured there'd be more poop questions (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35770741) |
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 3:18 PM Author: fiercely-loyal abusive set What was your exercise level?
|
|
Date: April 5th, 2018 3:27 PM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit I didn't go out of my way to do any extra exercising, but I didn't avoid it either. I had a few days of moving that went pretty well. I had been fasting a few weeks and I think my muscles were pretty adapted to using fat for fuel. I've been into lifting in the past but not in a couple years and have a squat rack at home. I didn't lift but have been trying to reacclimate myself to the movements by just squatting/deadlifting with the bar. Gonna start that back up again now that I'm eating |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 12:18 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35775649) |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 12:28 AM Author: ruddy selfie i bet if you eased into it by progressively cutting out carbs and then jumping into a water fast it would be even easier to succeed. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35775691) |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 2:22 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit Yeah definitely. Being already in ketosis/fat adapted would certainly make the transition less painful. I’m sort of impulsive about this kind of stuff so think I just said fuck it after overeating some pizza one night. (Knew I was going to start fasting eventually but picked the start on a whim) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35776127) |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 12:32 AM Author: fishy gaming laptop newt describe your bowel movements, if any during the latter half of the fast (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35775704) |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 1:44 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit I probably only shat 3 or 4 times total and once in the last 3 weeks. Just a couple small dense turds that sank like rocks. Lots of wiping required. I’ve written extensively on the subject of faeces. See http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=307916&forum_id=2#4426341 and http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=799345&forum_id=2#9632483 Actually now that I think about it I don’t have many posts about anything else over the years. I’ll occasionally post about galaga and early 90’s Houston oilers wide receiver Haywood Jeffries. |
|
Date: April 9th, 2018 1:04 PM Author: fishy gaming laptop newt 180 post from 2008 (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35798686) |
|
Date: April 9th, 2018 1:06 PM Author: Motley doobsian travel guidebook (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35798707) |
|
Date: October 26th, 2018 5:14 PM Author: racy disgusting menage (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#37102176) |
|
Date: October 26th, 2018 5:15 PM Author: Zippy razzle-dazzle antidepressant drug temple (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#37102182) |
|
Date: July 11th, 2022 12:10 PM Author: spectacular fuchsia tattoo (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#44831353) |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 1:45 AM Author: Amber Sanctuary Jewess Thats terrific.
I stopped taking any $ or cards with me to work and that's given me like a 8-9 hour daily fast (just water) without me even needing willpower. I have issues with candy, soda, and submarine sandwiches. I still have takeout for dinner a lot but at least cutting out the midday eating means fewer calories overall. |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 1:54 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit That’s awesome but if you’re going to skip a meal, breakfast is the one to skip (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35776034) |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 2:43 AM Author: Amber Sanctuary Jewess Disagree, too tempting to hunt for lunch then. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35776185) |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 3:03 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit My point was that 16 consecutive hours of fasting is more effective than 2 separate 8 hour chunks (counting sleep) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35776226) |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 3:15 AM Author: Amber Sanctuary Jewess I'm fine with how this is going. It's sustainable and not stressful. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35776247) |
|
Date: February 18th, 2019 11:14 AM Author: heady rambunctious market I skip dinner for the same reason (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#37801618) |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 2:06 AM Author: Submissive wild senate Does drinking caffeinated beverages break fast by starting metabolism? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35776076) |
|
Date: April 6th, 2018 2:17 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit No in fact caffeine is recommended as a way to aid in fasting. Won’t break a fast unless there’s calories (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#35776106) |
|
Date: April 9th, 2018 1:08 PM Author: lascivious silver church idea he suggested 180, I got from 315 to 250 by following Fung’s advice. Never did a fast longer than 60 hours though.
|
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 11:45 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit UPDATE: After the fast I ate maintenance for a month and have been doing alternate day fasting the last 3 weeks. Been losing around 3 lbs/week so far. In the 240's now. My goal is to get under 200 (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36111497) |
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 11:49 AM Author: Galvanic Prole Striped Hyena Awesome brother congrats.
I’m gonna go back and read the obsesity code because of this bump |
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 11:54 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit He also has a lot of good content on youtube that summarizes a lot of what's in the book (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36111541) |
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 12:19 PM Author: Galvanic Prole Striped Hyena Did you really water fast for SIXTY days?? Seems impossible to me. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36111745) |
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 12:22 PM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit I did. Not impossible. The world record is from a scottish man in the 60's who didn't eat for around 13 months I believe and went from around 425 to 180. All depends on how much fat you have (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36111771) |
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 11:52 AM Author: ungodly toaster mad cow disease 180
Whats your pooping habits with alternate day fasting? |
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 11:57 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit every other day or so. I'm doing keto when I do eat so that probably plays a role in turd composition, density, texture etc. I hear people complain about pungent turds while on keto and I suppose they have a strong aroma but I will say that pooping in general has been a relaxing experience with little wiping involved. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36111564) |
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 11:55 AM Author: carmine sweet tailpipe half-breed how did u get so fat in the first place (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36111550) |
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 11:59 AM Author: ungodly toaster mad cow disease GC + biglaw + drop in basal metabolic rate is my guess (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36111571) |
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 11:59 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit It was from food (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36111573) |
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 12:21 PM Author: appetizing impertinent round eye mad-dog skullcap (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36111766) |
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 12:11 PM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit In all seriousness it's obviously from overeating, whether for emotional reasons or whatever. My opinion is at the beginning when you're just starting to get fat it's 100% on you, but as you continue to gain weight the blame starts to shift a bit to the hormone imbalance you've created (insulin resistance). The hormones are what control your body set point and amount of hunger. Your body isn't getting what it needs from food due to insulin resistance so you stay hungry and gain even more weight the next year, and so on (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36111666) |
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 12:12 PM Author: frozen abode had no idea this was possible
that's a lot of days |
|
Date: May 23rd, 2018 12:20 PM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit The propaganda from the food industry worked like a charm. It's going to be a while before the idea goes away that we must eat every 2 hours to 'stoke the metabolism'. It turns out the opposite is true (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36111756) |
|
Date: July 11th, 2022 12:07 PM Author: Cowardly gaping boltzmann (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#44831341) |
|
Date: May 26th, 2018 6:11 PM Author: Crystalline curious base boistinker 180 man, very happy for you. Longest fast I ever did was 7 days, but I did it three separate times. Lost 70 pounds over about a year to go from 220 to 150. Now of course is the real test of not getting fat again. I'm lifting now and far more active plus I totally changed my typical eating habits to cut out shitcarbs, so I'm hopeful I can be in the elite 5% who don't relapse. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36132972) |
|
Date: May 27th, 2018 10:28 AM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit Thanks man. You’re one of the few folks on here I’ve heard talk about fasting. If you lost your weight mostly by fasting I’d say you’re in a much better position long term than those who lost by calorie restriction since your insulin should now be lower. That’s the key to keeping it off, or so I’ve heard. Time will tell (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36135378) |
|
Date: May 27th, 2018 12:26 PM Author: Ivory offensive step-uncle's house What’s the point? You’ll still be a bald incel (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36135755) |
|
Date: May 27th, 2018 1:49 PM Author: Crystalline curious base boistinker I won't be a fat out-of-shape piece of shit? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36136152) |
|
Date: May 27th, 2018 3:32 PM Author: Ivory offensive step-uncle's house The marginal value of being fit when you’re bald anyways is very low (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36136540) |
|
Date: May 27th, 2018 4:28 PM Author: Crystalline curious base boistinker Lol no. Being fit instead of fat means you have better health, more energy, more athleticism, and feel better day to day. It's much better than being a fattie. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#36136799) |
|
Date: May 27th, 2018 10:43 AM Author: Cruel-hearted People Who Are Hurt i have another thread somewhere on here. Fasting is the only thing that works for me. I'm doing IF/keto now - trying to skip meals/days as much as I can.
only diet success I have ever had has ben with fasting/keto. Keto works for me because it breaks the reliance on carbs to "feel good" and allows me to fast. |
|
Date: October 26th, 2018 5:09 PM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit UPDATE: I weigh 188 now, so down about 130 lbs since February (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#37102144) |
|
Date: October 26th, 2018 5:16 PM Author: racy disgusting menage Congrats. Very impressive. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#37102191) |
|
Date: October 26th, 2018 5:17 PM Author: Primrose comical pozpig poast before/after pics, twink boi (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#37102195) |
|
Date: October 26th, 2018 5:17 PM Author: Zippy razzle-dazzle antidepressant drug temple 180 friend good job (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#37102196) |
|
Date: October 26th, 2018 5:21 PM Author: Orange home liquid oxygen Holy shit 180.
I'm tempted to try to copy you.
What additional lessons have you learned? |
|
Date: October 26th, 2018 5:36 PM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit Fuck yeah DO IT!
For motivation watch all this guy's videos - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APhNExaARrk |
|
Date: February 18th, 2019 11:26 AM Author: Bistre principal's office persian LOL. 180 (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#37801684) |
|
Date: October 26th, 2018 5:23 PM Author: Bossy Fanboi Congrats! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#37102225) |
|
Date: October 26th, 2018 5:40 PM Author: cheese-eating state pocket flask 130? 180! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#37102308) |
|
Date: February 18th, 2019 11:18 AM Author: heady rambunctious market Amazing (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#37801641) |
|
Date: October 26th, 2018 6:05 PM Author: Big indecent orchestra pit Been following the snake diet protocol (linked above) where you basically just fast as long as you can while drinking salt water, assuming you're still a fatass. In practice I usually eat every 4th or 5th day. I eat as much as I want on those days (in a 4-6 hour window) but keep it to healthy foods. I'm now of the opinion that humans were meant to fast and should consider it as important for health as getting enough sleep or exercising. The F bomb is definitely powerful.
|
|
Date: October 26th, 2018 6:11 PM Author: Primrose comical pozpig Careful, comrade. (((Food Industry))) will try to silence you. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#37102437) |
|
Date: February 19th, 2019 8:33 PM Author: flickering odious ticket booth macaca (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#37810551) |
|
Date: January 6th, 2022 1:42 AM Author: irradiated institution cuck (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#43737855) |
|
Date: May 10th, 2023 4:34 PM Author: charismatic magenta indian lodge flame. you'd die if u went 60 days without food. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3939986&forum_id=2#46295289) |