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AI will kill all the lawyers: A barrister’s warning
Poast new message in this thread
Date: December 19th, 2025 1:23 PM Author: Sickened Garrison Genital Piercing https://spectator.com/article/ai-will-kill-all-the-lawyers/ (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522670) |
Date: December 19th, 2025 1:51 PM Author: razzle-dazzle swollen theater Read this. Even if true, nothing novel in this article. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522724) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 1:55 PM Author: Maize Indian Lodge why would I read it then (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522734) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 1:57 PM Author: razzle-dazzle swollen theater I read this (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522742) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 1:59 PM Author: Arousing Sinister Private Investor Locale (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522750) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:19 PM Author: fragrant saffron university (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522819) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 1:55 PM Author: fragrant saffron university Good (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522736) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 1:57 PM Author: jet-lagged metal lettuce athletic conference Lawyer-Rorschach "DO ITTTTTT" (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522740) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 1:57 PM Author: concupiscible pearl dilemma circlehead Oh no! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522744) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 1:59 PM Author: Claret galvanic marketing idea fine tuned deepseek v5 running on Tesla bot firmware - hunting down mid 40s balding, long nosed men (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522749) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 1:59 PM Author: Misanthropic codepig We took a real, recent and important case – a complex civil court appeal which I wrote, and it took me a day and a half. We redacted all identifying details, for anonymity and confidentiality, and we fed the same case to Grok Heavy AI. And then we asked it to do what I did. After some prompting, the end result was…’ He shakes his head. ‘Spectacular. Actually staggering. It did it in 30 seconds, and it was much better than mine. And remember, I am very good at this.’
He sits back, wry yet resigned. ‘It was at the level of a truly great KC. The best possible legal document. And all done in seconds for pennies. How can any of us compete? We can’t.’
I doubt this guy "James" knows what the level of truly great legal work is |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:00 PM Author: lascivious pistol I have a big mess of a compliance matter brewing in the UK with the FCA . The reg is crystal clear that our initial position is the correct one. UK counsel has told me that for 40 years the FCA has just done it differently and will be raping us regardless of the wording. So much regulatory shit is like this it’s scary. Right now I’m waiting on SEC comments on a product registration statement. The shutdown fucked over our timing but counsel told me if we just had a lobbyist first we would be pushed to a different department and get comments two weeks sooner. Half this shit is literally “paying for play” or having deep institutional knowledge because shit isn’t written down. Litigation is like this too. You need to have previously argued before a judge to gauge shit. Lawyers are not going anywhere. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522760) |
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Date: December 20th, 2025 11:48 AM Author: Dashing plaza (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49525200) |
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Date: December 20th, 2025 11:50 AM Author: Dun cruel-hearted national electric furnace (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49525202) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:02 PM Author: lascivious pistol Grok won’t output in .docx or produce PDFs you can download. The shit it yields will take you longer to format than to write from scratch. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522773) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:03 PM Author: Ruddy Federal Psychic you can pay a legal assistant to do that shit. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522776) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:05 PM Author: Claret galvanic marketing idea use Claude skills tp (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522781) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:07 PM Author: concupiscible pearl dilemma circlehead this is how fucking retarded lawyers are, to think "not outputting in docx or producing PDFs" is in any way significant. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522785) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:10 PM Author: magical impressive locus dog poop (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522796) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:59 PM Author: Beady-eyed Effete Boistinker "not a lawyer here. let me explain to you how to be a lawyer and what lawyers need" (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522965) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 3:03 PM Author: fragrant saffron university Have you ever even used AI to do anything man
I'm not a lawyer but I have this same gripe. Many of the things that you want to use AI to do are small things that don't actually take you very long. And if the AI can't spit out a finished work product or something very close to finished, it doesn't actually save you time and money to use it instead of just quickly banging it out yourself |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 3:09 PM Author: concupiscible pearl dilemma circlehead My point is export format is an absolutely trivial thing to overcome and there are already plenty of tools to export in formats like this (and it's not particularly hard to prompt existing AI tools to write a small amount of code to do this even without using some custom wrapper). Attaching any significance to that whatsoever is a signal that someone really doesn't understand how trivial their workflows are (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49523016) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 3:18 PM Author: fragrant saffron university He's referring to the desired formatting within a pdf document, not the words that grok generates being outputted within a pdf file
You speak so forcefully and confidently about this stuff but you don't understand it at all lol. Like just chill and listen to what other people are saying and think about it before you form an opinion |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 3:34 PM Author: concupiscible pearl dilemma circlehead He literally said "Grok won’t output in .docx or produce PDFs you can download." and you made some up convenient explanation for what he ACKSHUALLY meant. I am pretty damn confident that there is plenty of AI tooling which can, in fact, output in docx or produce PDFs that you can download. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49523142) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 3:08 PM Author: Beady-eyed Effete Boistinker for example AI was unable to do this (very simple, but annoying and time-consuming) task. shit like this makes up a mind-boggling percentage of the practice of law and what we do has to be *perfect* because the other side is going to flyspeck it to pieces
https://www.autoadmit.com/post.php?parent_thread_id=5722762&forum_id=2 |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 3:16 PM Author: Motley brilliant associate nice link. lol @ lawyers holy shit
Date: December 19th, 2025 3:08 PM Author: santa's top guy
for example AI was unable to do this (very simple, but annoying and time-consuming) task. shit like this makes up a mind-boggling percentage of the practice of law and what we do has to be *perfect* because the other side is going to flyspeck it to pieces https://www.autoadmit.com/post.php?parent_thread_id=5722762&forum_id=2 |
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Date: December 20th, 2025 11:38 AM Author: Garnet bat shit crazy site Why the FUCK are you using Grok? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49525163) |
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Date: December 20th, 2025 11:50 AM Author: Dun cruel-hearted national electric furnace Save-As - Select "PDF" (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49525203) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:02 PM Author: Ruddy Federal Psychic who wants to be the first GC to recommend just using AI instead of biglaw? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522774) |
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Date: December 20th, 2025 11:51 AM Author: Dashing plaza i'm sure there are tech startups strapped for cash that are already doing it (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49525205) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:10 PM Author: Unholy Boltzmann Kitchen It’s going to kill off the worst lawyers a lot sooner than the best / senior ones. But it’s true that it’s already a lot more useful than the avg junior or mid level on stuff like research or diligence, which sucks for them since that’s most of their worth. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522795) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:11 PM Author: Provocative immigrant “It did it in 30 seconds, and it was much better than mine. And remember, I am very good at this.” (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522797) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:14 PM Author: Unholy Boltzmann Kitchen It’s capable of being better than almost anyone at anything from a knowledge standpoint but the huge * to that is that it needs comprehensive context first. Who is going to put that together? Only someone senior enough to know what’s useful. One day it will just be plugged into everything and then we are fucked though. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522804) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:24 PM Author: Misanthropic codepig "One day it will just be plugged into everything"
It never will be, see the comment from the poaster above about the UK FCA and how they dont do things by the book |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:13 PM Author: Stimulating mustard base state bars will just require a human to be in the loop on all legal filings
so even if someone makes an LLM that anyone can use to do their legal work you’ll still have to pay a lawyer |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:15 PM Author: Unholy Boltzmann Kitchen This is basically the gist of all proposed EU stuff too (beyond law) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522808) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:35 PM Author: Ruddy Federal Psychic yeah but that means some rainmaker is going to autopen everything and cop 10x salary that used to go to associates. and/or TTT lawyers will let you use their license for rock bottom prices like a notary. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522881) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 3:14 PM Author: Big son of senegal Exactly (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49523042) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:15 PM Author: electric splenetic internal respiration was hoping to be more literally and biologically killed by ai tbh (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522809) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:18 PM Author: fragrant saffron university In all seriousness though LLMs still can't do novel thinking
Any legal analysis that it does that comes out correct is only correct because there happens to be similar enough cases in its training data
In the future there will be LLMs that are as good as lawyers but it is going to take a lot of very expensive reinforcement learning to get there |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:20 PM Author: concupiscible pearl dilemma circlehead what percentage of lawyers actually do "novel thinking"? <1%? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522821) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:23 PM Author: fragrant saffron university In general they don't do much by human standards. But you have to understand how much of what our brains do is based on our ability to construct novel abstract models of whatever it is that we're dealing with. LLMs can't do that. So even small discrepancies from the patterns in its training data mean that they end up at the totally wrong conclusions
So many people speak so confidently on this stuff when they've never actually tried it themselves. Like you can just spend a couple hours with any of the leading frontier models prompting them with cases and you will understand their strengths and weaknesses and what they can and can't do. But nobody does this because they are lazy and dumb and don't really care |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 3:22 PM Author: Motley brilliant associate Ok but everything besides the abstraction modeling can be done with AI now. I almost never directly type code into an IDE now. I formulate the systems and logic I need and dictate to AI and it shits me out code. You can do the same with your review, research, and writing. Specify what to parse, research, and write. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49523086) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 3:25 PM Author: fragrant saffron university This is because they have done billions and billions of dollars of reinforcement learning to make the models good at coding specifically
That is what it will take to make them equally good at lawyering (and everything else that they're capable of being good at) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 3:32 PM Author: Motley brilliant associate Well the way you guys explain it--it sounds like you're trying to chain AI workflows together expecting to just show it the case and then have it deduce what to research and write a counter lawyer docufagument from start to finish.
I would never tell AI my coding "problem" and just expect it to write a solution unless I have a cookie cutter template of a logically identical problem-->solution for it to reference. Which is why someone like CLSG could probably use it in this way to churn inifinitely more PI cases |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 3:35 PM Author: fragrant saffron university Yeah you're on the right track and that is imo what it will be primarily used for in law once the models are ready for it (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49523147) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:37 PM Author: Ruddy Federal Psychic (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522886) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:23 PM Author: obsidian hall shitlib (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522830) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 2:24 PM Author: Provocative immigrant Rat-faced barrister: "It's just like when me mum died in the Holly." (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49522837) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 3:32 PM Author: cerebral brass center maybe it's not all bad (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49523137) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 4:36 PM Author: magical impressive locus dog poop "AI" is overhyped to a large degree if you ask me. I use it every fucking day at work and it honestly is not that great. Useful in certain situations here and there, that's about it. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49523306) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 9:38 PM Author: rough-skinned peach french chef It’s useful and saves time but you have to know the right prompts to ask. I’m sure it’ll get better, but AI isn’t going to be getting a case in and handling it from start to finish in the next 5 years imo. Maybe 10 or 15, but even then I doubt it. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49523952) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 9:17 PM Author: Talented buff shrine AI will make lawyers more productive (which means senior lawyers will need less paraleagls or juniors), but it can't kill human lawyers.
Here's a great example - i was doing a contract, and this smart tech founder obviously ran the contract through some legal AI and sent me a list of 50 comments. 10 of the comments were good comments, 30 of them non-issues, and 10 of them were wrong.
But the tech person didn't know what any of the comments meant or what issues were important. So I just told them more or less to fuck off.
Lawyers are always going to have a job because a human needs to actually review the contract, or at least review the AI summary, and report back to the rest of the business.
If it ever gets to the point where AI bots are negotiating against AI bots, and then AI bots are making the business decisions, etc - then lawyers are fucked - but at that point, what isn't fucked? |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 10:21 PM Author: Frum partner Outside counsel is DONE HERE (maybe) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49524033) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 10:22 PM Author: Adventurous emerald bbw (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49524036) |
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Date: December 19th, 2025 11:00 PM Author: Doobsian temple friendly grandma "And activist judges are a curse, which will soon be lifted."
To be replaced by activist programmers and tech giants. |
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Date: December 20th, 2025 12:11 PM Author: Ruddy Federal Psychic it's 2050 and the POTUS is deciding between appointing a SCOTUS bot with a 25% conservative bias or one with a 45% bias. advisors recommend the 25% bot, which would more easily pass through a divided congress. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49525244) |
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Date: December 20th, 2025 12:13 PM Author: Garnet bat shit crazy site I'm still LOLing at the idiot who complained "won't save to pdf"
Does your associate / secretary send you draft documents in pdf to review? |
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Date: December 20th, 2025 5:20 PM Author: Beady-eyed Effete Boistinker "a complex civil court appeal" "it took me a day and a half" |
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Date: December 20th, 2025 5:22 PM Author: Vigorous principal's office (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49526100) |
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Date: December 20th, 2025 7:54 PM Author: razzle-dazzle swollen theater (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49526323) |
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Date: December 20th, 2025 8:28 PM Author: Frum partner Lol missed that on the first read (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49526358) |
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Date: December 20th, 2025 5:21 PM Author: Sadistic Keepsake Machete Degenerate who's Al (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5812199&forum_id=2Vannesa#49526099) |
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Date: December 20th, 2025 8:27 PM Author: razzle-dazzle swollen theater it's a city in canaan mentioned in the book of joshua
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